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November 22, 2019, 8:06 am UTC    
October 06, 2019 07:08PM
L Cooper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> cladking Wrote:
>
> > My favorite being that "atum's" shadow is above
> him,
>
> Could you tell me where in the PT's you find this.
> Thanks.

Utterance #574

1485a. To say: Greetings to thee, Sycamore, who protects the god, under which the gods of the underworld stand,

1485b. whose tips are seared, whose inside is burned, (whose) suffering is real.

1486a. Assemble those who dwell in Nun; collect those who are among the bows.

1486b. Thy forehead is upon thine arm (in mourning) for Osiris, O Great Mooring-post,

1486c. who art like her who is chief of the offering (to), and of the worship (?) of the lord of the East.

1487a. Thou art standing, Osiris; thy shadow is over thee, Osiris;

The literal meaning of this appears to make sense. The "sycamore" is the djed or "mooring-post" which controls water flow and is under the processes creating the pyramid. It assembles those forces within the waters of the abyss who come to be among the bows. "Osiris" by the time this was written has already usurped the role of "atum". If we had an earlier version of the Pyramid Texts the king would have always been referred to (when the subject of a sentence) as "atum/ N" .

Faulkner refers to the "bows" as the "celestial expanse". The stars are the droplets which create the rainbow so it is literally the "expanse of the stars". Utt #570 though is the true "rainbow utterance" since there are several references in it.

In order to have a shadow above one must either cause a rainbow or have a light below.

Obviously no line in the Pyramid Texts proves it was meant literally. But my contention is that when taken literally every line makes perfect sense. This line, for instance agrees that the "gods" are creating above; 502b. "The double doors of heaven are locked; the way goes over the flames under that which the gods create, which allows each Horus to glide through, in which N. will glide through, in this flame under that which the gods create". Our minds automatically parse these words and interpret them to be metaphoric because the literal meaning in no case makes sense to us.

It's very difficult for me to believe that they imagined a god in a room with a light below and his shadow on the ceiling or outside with a shadow on some tall edifice. But "rainbows" create their own shadows between the primary and secondary rainbows. At dusk and sunset the light is above and the shadows below so there are an extremely limited number of literal meanings for saying that one's shadow is above him. Note also that in this passage with the shadow above that the "sycamore" is entreated to "gather those from the watery abyss among the (rain)bows".

It is not in any way necessary to interpret this as I do but it appears to make literal sense. Osiris; shadow is literally above him in utterance 273 as well;

393a. To say: The sky is overcast, the stars are darkened,
393b. the bows are agitated, the bones of the earth-gods quake.

[www.sacred-texts.com]

The sky isn't "overcast" but rather the water flies up into the shadow between the rainbows and is no longer visible.

____________
Man fears the pyramid, time fears man.
Subject Author Posted

Still avoiding facts I see (with topic "Atum's Shadow")

Hans October 06, 2019 11:06AM

Atum's Shadow

L Cooper October 06, 2019 11:54AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

cladking October 06, 2019 07:08PM

The advantage of never documenting anything

Hans October 06, 2019 10:46PM

Re: The advantage of never documenting anything

cladking October 07, 2019 08:09AM

Re: The advantage of never documenting anything

Hans October 07, 2019 08:58AM

Re: The advantage of never documenting anything

cladking October 07, 2019 09:37AM

It time to stop making claims and provide evidence

Hans October 07, 2019 12:05PM

Re: It time to stop making claims and provide evidence

cladking October 07, 2019 02:14PM

Re: It time to stop making claims and provide evidence

Hans October 07, 2019 04:19PM

Re: Atum's Shadow

L Cooper October 07, 2019 08:23AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

Spiros October 07, 2019 08:46AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

Spiros October 11, 2019 08:39AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

L Cooper October 12, 2019 08:45AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

cladking October 12, 2019 09:24AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

L Cooper October 13, 2019 08:58AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

cladking October 13, 2019 09:13AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

Spiros October 18, 2019 07:44AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

Hans October 07, 2019 09:07AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

cladking October 07, 2019 09:29AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

L Cooper October 07, 2019 02:28PM

Re: Atum's Shadow

cladking October 07, 2019 08:13PM

Challenge taken

Hans October 08, 2019 05:49PM

Re: Challenge taken

cladking October 09, 2019 07:56AM

Your prediction was wrong Cladking

Hans October 09, 2019 10:35AM

Re: Challenge taken

cladking October 10, 2019 05:52PM

Re: Challenge taken

Hans October 10, 2019 07:38PM

Re: Atum's Shadow

Chris Tedder October 09, 2019 04:05AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

cladking October 09, 2019 08:06AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

Hans October 09, 2019 10:47AM

Re: Atum's Shadow

cladking October 09, 2019 09:42PM

Re: Atum's Shadow

Hans October 09, 2019 11:52PM

Re: Atum's Shadow

cladking October 09, 2019 09:52PM

Pretending

Hans October 09, 2019 11:25PM

Re: Pretending

cladking October 10, 2019 05:34PM

Substituting Upwards for Shu failure of the ancient language idea

Hans October 10, 2019 05:38PM

Re: Substituting Upwards for Shu failure of the ancient language idea

cladking October 10, 2019 05:56PM

Re: Substituting Upwards for Shu failure of the ancient language idea

Hans October 14, 2019 11:27AM

"Shu" Means "Upward".

cladking October 14, 2019 12:52PM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

L Cooper October 14, 2019 01:22PM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

Hans October 14, 2019 07:08PM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

cladking October 14, 2019 08:05PM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

Hans October 14, 2019 11:10PM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

cladking October 15, 2019 08:57AM

Still pretending you can translate AE by looking at the English translation..

Hans October 15, 2019 09:14AM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

L Cooper October 15, 2019 09:25AM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

Hans October 15, 2019 12:19PM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

cladking October 16, 2019 08:45AM

Why not just show us your research and data? Why are you hiding it?

Hans October 16, 2019 09:57AM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

Byrd October 15, 2019 05:39PM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

Hans October 15, 2019 06:47PM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

Hermione October 16, 2019 02:30AM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

cladking October 16, 2019 09:05AM

Re: "Shu" Can Mean Many Things

cladking October 16, 2019 09:03AM

More opinion presented as 'fact'

Hans October 16, 2019 09:55AM

Re: More opinion presented as 'fact'

cladking October 16, 2019 04:40PM

Re: More opinion presented as 'fact'

Hans October 16, 2019 05:21PM

Re: More opinion presented as 'fact'

cladking October 16, 2019 06:01PM

Cladking accepts that his idea was falsified

Hans October 16, 2019 07:08PM

Your idea is falsified

Hans October 14, 2019 07:06PM

Substituting Upwards for Shu failure of the ancient language idea

Hans October 10, 2019 05:36PM

Re: Atum's Shadow

cladking October 10, 2019 06:12PM

Re: Atum's Shadow

Hans October 10, 2019 07:38PM

Re: Atum's Shadow

Hans October 21, 2019 07:16PM



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