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August 8, 2020, 5:39 am UTC    
January 02, 2020 11:03PM
robin cook Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi Kanga
>
> You seem to be sympathetic to the idea that Khufu
> was designed geometrically and that shaft angles
> were adusted to target stars which, at this epoch,
> serendipitiously had altitudes evoking the
> pyramid's geometry - as a way of linking the earth
> to stellar mythology I suppose.

It's hard to tell whether the geometric scheme came first or the astronomical scheme. Certainly the 154c level is the most important level in the geometric scheme, creating the 280c diagonal for this level, and the 99c diagonal for KCS at the same time.

> Butler states that "the descending passages in the
> Meydum Pyramid, Bent Pyramid, Bent subsidiary
> Pyramid, Second Pyramid, and Third Pyramid were
> also doubly bent". (To which might be added
> Khufu's descending passage - bent at the junction
> of the rock-cut and built portions).

Waggy has given us the data for Meidum's passage and shows that it is triply bent. It's uppermost segment has a gradient of 7:12, presumably pointing to Thuban's upper culmination. Curiously, this is the same gradient used in the upper portion of the Bent W passage. There seems to be an interplay of both geometric and astronomical elements in the Meidum passage.

> Well, the survey data for pyramids not surveyed by Petrie
> remains somewhat shaky (as Hamilton has observed),
> Butler seems largely to rely on the figures of
> Maragioglio and Rinaldi. But putting this aside,
> if these other passages also pointed at stars what
> were they?

Thanks to Waggy's research, I have been able to establish the two sekeds in the Bent N pyramid. For the most part, its seked is 14 palms (1:2 slope), but in the final upper portion, its seked is 14½ palms. However, this does not point accurately to Thuban's upper culmination for this latitude and epoch. There just appears to be a ½ palm shift in the seked. Maybe it has something to do with the elevation of the entrance, as is the case in the Meidum pyramid. (It's entrance is at 35 cubits elevation, which is one-fifth of the height of the pyramid.)

> Does 'Djoser's box' point to a particular star?
> (Uncertain dating certainly doesn't help).

The uncertainty of the angle of viewing doesn't help either.

> (btw Legon presents his proposition
> for the bend in the Bent west passage here -
> [www.legon.demon.co.uk] )

I agree with his analysis of the heights of the upper and lower portions as 110c and 90c, but not with his assumption that the base is a whole number of cubits. This leads to the conclusion that the lower portion is comprised of two different slopes of 10:7 and 7:5 - much too complicated. I think the base is 361c 5p. This gives a single uniform slope of 10:7 (but an awkward seked of 4 + 9/10 palms!). The bendline is 235c 5p. This is worked out from the upper portion's height of 110c and slope of 14:15 (seked 7½ palms). I would also say that Robins' and Shute's seked of 5 palms for the lower portion is definitely wrong. The maths just won't work out, and Robins and Shute never even attempted doing it!

Miatello gives the profile triangle for the lower section as 63c-90c-110c.

> As to the geometric aspects of the design the
> chambers and passages appear to have been laid out
> with reference to the fundamental proportions of
> the pyramid, as much discussed on this forum. For
> example the elementary root 2 division of the
> height to locate the floor of the KC uses the same
> proportion that appears in Gantenbrink's analysis
> as 280 / 198.

Absolutely.

> The centre lines of Gantenbrink's shafts converge
> 77 cubits above base and 22 from the centre.

However, the King's Chamber is not set symmetrically above this point. The chamber is offset 21 cubits from the E-W central axis. Why this 1 cubit difference?

> But what exactly is the crucial
> position of the break in angle further up the
> shaft? Where does Gantenbrink give this
> information on his site? Perhaps that Djedi site
> presents better data, I must check.

I don't think the Djedi people contributed anything further on KCN or KCS, only to confirm that Gantenbrink was largely correct. Gantenbrink merely records the angle of the final portion to the nearest 0.1° and he gives its length to the nearest metre, not enough information to know the exact coordinates of the bend in the upper part of KCN.

"The 'Mankiller' tunnel is accessible from the outside of the Pyramid, so we could manually measure the angle of shaft inclination through this section. The average angle is 31.20°, determined by 5 measurements made over a length of 11 m."

- Rudolf Gantenbrink, "The Findings... THE UPPER NORTHERN SHAFT" - [www.cheops.org]

11m is about 21 cubits, which is about 16%, or one sixth, of the length of the shaft.

Tan 31.20° = 0.60562. This could be interpreted as 0.6 (3:5; or 30.96°), but more likely 0.609 (14:23; or 31.33°)

> I mentioned that KC north shaft in plan is not
> parallel to the meridian but veers by a few
> degrees to the east (after the bend to the west to
> avoid the Grand Gallery). But all passages are
> constructed in the east half of the pyramid (I had
> intended to put up this plan which originated with
> Gantenbrink here but I've also got computer
> problems - I used Imgur for years but it has
> changed and I can't find the format for a bulletin
> board link. Getting old I guess). The divergence
> is too large to dismiss as sloppy work, and it is
> difficult to relate to known geometric schemes. If
> it targets Thuban then this would not be at
> culmination. What then?

But it would be at culmination if the final part of the shaft were taken as pointing due north and the angle were taken as seked 11½ palms.

> I have experimented with your scheme for KC exit
> levels, and while your vertical dimension from
> Ascending/Gallery floorline junction to north
> shaft exit is indeed 110 cubits and is relatable
> to the 440 base and 88 sloping length of the
> Gallery, the only connection I can see with a
> 'virtual pyramid' of base 200 and height 127.3
> would be the 100 cubit dimension from the Gallery
> junction horizontally to the centre of the KC.

The KCN exit level at the top of course 102 seems to have nothing to do with the 200c base pyramid associated with the KCS exit at the top of course 103.

> I'm afraid I don't agree with your statement - "It
> was all a very elaborate plan to set traps for the
> unwary". I can understand that in later times,
> when tomb-robbing was rife, king's might have
> wished to conceal their tombs.

Not only were there physical traps, there were also intellectual traps, designed to mislead. I guess what I am saying is, we must be careful how we proceed analytically. In my view, this pyramid, indeed all the pyramids, present themselves as intellectual puzzles.

> Rather, in the great pyramid age, they surely wished to appeal to
> the gods rather than presenting them with problems to solve.

The pyramids do not present the gods with problems to solve. They present us with problems to solve; or perhaps all these patterns were set for the deceased king to figure out, to equip him with the necessary mathematical tools (such as 99/70 and 140/99 for r2) which enable him to find the proper angles for the shafts, and find his way through the heavens.

> The game is still afoot and the best
> thing I can do is to seek out more solid data (and
> see if I can find a better picture-hosting site).

Sherlock Research
Subject Author Posted

Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Hermione December 15, 2019 04:35AM

THE ORION CORRELATION THEORY (OCT) PUT TO THE TEST

Hermione December 15, 2019 04:37AM

Re: THE ORION CORRELATION THEORY (OCT) PUT TO THE TEST

Hermione December 15, 2019 04:43AM

Re: THE ORION CORRELATION THEORY (OCT) PUT TO THE TEST

Spiros December 15, 2019 09:17AM

Re: THE ORION CORRELATION THEORY (OCT) PUT TO THE TEST

Hermione December 15, 2019 11:32AM

Re: THE ORION CORRELATION THEORY (OCT) PUT TO THE TEST

Hermione December 15, 2019 12:16PM

Re: THE ORION CORRELATION THEORY (OCT) PUT TO THE TEST

Spiros December 16, 2019 08:47AM

**Moderation note**

Hermione December 20, 2019 12:10PM

Re: **Moderation note**

Spiros December 20, 2019 01:03PM

Re: **Moderation note**

Hermione December 20, 2019 01:21PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Byrd December 23, 2019 03:41PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

cladking December 23, 2019 05:23PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

John B December 25, 2019 06:49PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Nemtinakht December 26, 2019 09:26PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

cladking December 26, 2019 09:46PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Nemtinakht December 26, 2019 10:17PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

cladking December 27, 2019 10:59AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Hans December 27, 2019 11:28AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Hans December 23, 2019 06:10PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Pistol December 24, 2019 06:18AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Hans December 24, 2019 10:55AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

L Cooper December 24, 2019 07:39PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

cladking December 25, 2019 08:29PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

robin cook December 27, 2019 03:13PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Hans December 27, 2019 04:56PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

cladking December 27, 2019 08:05PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Hans December 27, 2019 10:25PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Kanga December 27, 2019 10:31PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Spiros December 28, 2019 12:35PM

What is the level of KC shaft exits?

robin cook December 30, 2019 12:39PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Kanga December 31, 2019 11:23PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Kanga December 31, 2019 11:29PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Kanga December 31, 2019 11:39PM

Square root of all evil

Hermione January 01, 2020 02:00PM

Re: Square root of all evil

Kanga January 01, 2020 11:44PM

Re: Square root of all evil

Hermione January 02, 2020 05:39PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

robin cook January 01, 2020 08:20PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Kanga January 02, 2020 11:03PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

robin cook January 03, 2020 01:41PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Kanga January 04, 2020 07:53AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Kanga January 05, 2020 01:22AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Spiros January 05, 2020 11:11AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Hermione January 06, 2020 10:55AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Hans January 06, 2020 11:55AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Spiros January 06, 2020 05:18PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Hans January 06, 2020 07:11PM

starshaft correlations

robin cook January 06, 2020 08:39PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Chris Tedder January 06, 2020 11:06AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

robin cook January 06, 2020 01:30PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Chris Tedder January 06, 2020 05:08PM

The Starshafts

robin cook January 08, 2020 08:33PM

Re: The Starshafts

Chris Tedder January 13, 2020 01:37PM

Re: The Starshafts

Kanga January 14, 2020 02:15AM

Re: The Starshafts

Chris Tedder January 14, 2020 10:49AM

Re: The Starshafts

robin cook January 15, 2020 11:53AM

Re: The Starshafts

Jim Alison January 15, 2020 10:27PM

Re: The Starshafts

Kanga January 15, 2020 11:52PM

Re: The Starshafts

robin cook January 17, 2020 07:08AM

Re: The Starshafts

Jim Alison January 17, 2020 04:20PM

Re: The Starshafts

Chris Tedder January 17, 2020 01:23PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Chris Tedder January 06, 2020 05:11PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

robin cook January 06, 2020 09:01PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Byrd January 07, 2020 11:44AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

robin cook January 07, 2020 12:43PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Hans January 07, 2020 12:56PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Chris Tedder January 07, 2020 05:17PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Hans January 08, 2020 12:35AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Chris Tedder January 08, 2020 03:20PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

M. Williams January 09, 2020 12:00AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Hermione January 09, 2020 03:39AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Chris Tedder January 09, 2020 09:05AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

M. Williams January 09, 2020 10:50AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Chris Tedder January 09, 2020 03:19PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

M. Williams January 09, 2020 11:42PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Pistol January 10, 2020 04:51AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

cladking January 10, 2020 09:28AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Spiros January 11, 2020 09:04PM

the true target of the shafts

Spiros January 12, 2020 03:17PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Pistol January 10, 2020 04:22AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Hans January 10, 2020 01:01PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Chris Tedder January 07, 2020 01:08PM

Re: What about the Egyptian lunar cycle?

Mark Heaton January 07, 2020 03:25PM

Re: What about the Egyptian lunar cycle?

Chris Tedder January 07, 2020 04:17PM

Re: What about the Egyptian lunar cycle?

Mark Heaton January 07, 2020 07:50PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Kanga January 07, 2020 02:14AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Kanga January 07, 2020 02:28AM

the angles

Spiros January 02, 2020 09:22PM

Re: the angles

Spiros January 02, 2020 10:35PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Spiros January 04, 2020 10:59AM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Hans January 04, 2020 01:03PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Spiros January 04, 2020 01:18PM

Re: What is the level of KC shaft exits?

Hans January 04, 2020 01:23PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Spiros December 28, 2019 01:49PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Hans December 28, 2019 03:17PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Spiros December 28, 2019 04:32PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Hans December 29, 2019 12:29AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Spiros December 31, 2019 03:02PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Kanga December 29, 2019 12:16AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Hans December 29, 2019 12:31AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Kanga December 29, 2019 04:37AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Hans January 03, 2020 11:34PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Spiros December 25, 2019 06:51PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Kanga December 25, 2019 05:09PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

GChase January 16, 2020 06:34PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

GChase January 17, 2020 04:16AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

GChase January 19, 2020 12:07PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Chris Tedder January 19, 2020 04:46PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

GChase January 20, 2020 07:12AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Chris Tedder January 20, 2020 01:42PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Spiros January 20, 2020 05:49PM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

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Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

GChase January 22, 2020 04:33AM

Re: Archaeoastronomical Study of the Main Pyramids of Giza, Egypt: Possible Correlations with the Stars

Spiros January 25, 2020 02:28PM



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